The Queerest Podcast
🚀 Incoming Transmission: A New Podcast is Landing! 🌌✨
The Queerest Podcast is your cosmic guide to the Queer Universe. Hosted by Andraé BVR, each episode takes you on an interstellar journey through queer culture, identity, and influence. From dismantling media tropes to exploring queer representation, we invite you to challenge norms and expand your horizons. So, buckle up, set your phasers to fabulous—close encounters of the queerest kind await!
The Queerest Podcast
PRIDE IN PRACTICE: The Future of Queer-Affirming Care
In "Pride in Practice: The Future of Queer Care," host Andraé BVR dives into the transformative vision of Dr. Varuna Srinivasan. A physician, public health expert, and sex columnist for Allure, Dr. Srinivasan sheds light on their experiences as a nonbinary bisexual advocate and how these inform their pioneering leadership at Fluid Health. From unlearning societal norms to addressing systemic inequities in reproductive and sexual health, this episode explores what it means to create a healthcare system that champions intersectionality and inclusion.
I think so much of queer people and women, there's this idea that our body is utilitarian. we like exist to please someone sexually or that we exist to just get pregnant or that we exist to like do labor for this system that doesn't give us a lot back in return and so that when you're seeking help for something that's like innate to who you are like in exploring your sexuality exploring your sex life that doesn't feel natural and i think that's what we're trying to do is we're trying to like normalize a big part of that
SPEAKER_01:Welcome to The Queerest Podcast, your cosmic guide to the queer universe. Hosted by Andre BVR, each episode takes you on an interstellar journey through queer culture, identity, and influence. From dismantling media tropes to exploring queer representation, we invite you to challenge norms and expand your horizons. So buckle up and set your phasers to fabulous. Close encounters of the queerest kind await.
UNKNOWN:Bye.
SPEAKER_05:Greetings, cosmic peers and allies. I am your host, Andre BVR, and today we are diving into the revolutionary world of queer affirming care. I'm so excited to introduce our guest, Dr. Varna Srinivasan, a physician, public health expert, and a true trailblazer in reimagining healthcare for underserved communities. Dr. Srinivasan is a proud Johns Hopkins alum and a leader in reproductive health. They've created Planned Parenthood's first ever Asian American abortion toolkit bridging critical gaps in education. Recognized by Serena Williams as a woman of courage, Dr. Srinivasan is now the CEO of Fluid Health, where they are transforming care for chronic pelvic pain with compassionate, specialized therapy. Beyond their clinical work, Dr. Srinivasan is an accomplished writer. Their work has been featured in Cosmopolitan and Vogue India. They've been a sex columnist for Allure and part of Parents Magazine's review board. Their advocacy Thank you for having me. I know that I wrote that intro, but every time I hear it,
SPEAKER_03:I'm like, yes, I'm kind of a I
SPEAKER_05:would say this is my husband yesterday. I was just like, like, amazing accomplishments. The impact is global. You are telling it and it's so inspiring. I'm so glad to have you here.
SPEAKER_03:Thank you. Thank you for having me. I'm so excited and congratulations on the launch of your podcast. This is really incredible. The production value is out of this world. So I'm
SPEAKER_05:excited to be here. Yeah, absolutely. So just to get things kicked off, as far as our interview is concerned, your career spans medicine education writing advocacy what has inspired you to focus on sexual health and queer visibility
SPEAKER_03:you know i think i work under the umbrella of healthcare which is something that i've always been passionate about and when i was in india you go into med school quite early and so i feel like i've been preparing to be a physician since i was like 13. Actually, when I was really young, my dad asked me what I wanted to do. And I was like, I want to be a doctor. And then when I was a doctor, I was like, this is a lot. I want to work more so in public health. I didn't want to leave. health care as as a whole and i think that a lot of the interest that i have in working in in sexual health care is because i think that this is such a deeply politicized i think we can see that especially now with the current administration there is a lot more legislation there's a lot more conversation that goes on around what people can do with their bodies uh bodies are highly political um you know your gender your your sexuality is highly like influenced um It influences so many parts of our lives. But I think something that most people don't realize is how much our sexuality and our gender influences the health that we have and health care that we access. And so a big part of, I think, my work in sexual health and queer visibility is just rooted in one It's how does gender affect health and how can we make sure that people who are marginalized as a result of their gender or the sexuality of how they identify, how can they access care and how can they lead better lives? Because the system as we know it right now is essentially only built for cis het white men. Like a lot of the studies that we have, everything is extrapolated. When you think about like women's healthcare, everything kind of just comes down to, oh, we just need you to like get pregnant and give a baby. Nothing is kind of holistic or built around making them feel, making them healthier or giving them richer lives. And so I think a lot of my work is kind of rooted in diversifying healthcare and making sure that it's not just for one particular part of the population, healthcare should be for everyone. And I think sexual health kind of like embodies that.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I think that's absolutely, absolutely true. And I think like the lack of investment on research for women's and sexual minorities is so, it's abysmal, honestly, really. Cause it's like, there's so much research that's not done to understand the human body and how much that's harming, you know, the wider community for not that lack of investment. You know what I mean? So,
SPEAKER_04:absolutely.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. So wanna take a quick step back and kind of talk about, kind of your identity, you know, as a bisexual non-binary individual in a heterosexual marriage, how do you navigate the perceptions of your identity, both within the queer community and in broader society? Because I think that's such an interesting topic that is very nuanced.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, you know, this is kind of like a double edged sword. And I think my identity is what led me to a lot of the work I'm doing today is when I was reading so much about being bisexual. So I grew up in a conservative part of India. And being queer was not the norm. I did not know a single queer person. I'll be so honest. I had only met a couple of trans people. But they were also growing up in Chennai, which is in southern India. we still it wasn't like mainstream right and so i knew that i was like queer and i knew that i was bisexual but the norm there is that it's so there's like a compulsory heterosexuality or like a compulsory like and so much of what we see in the tv and with my parents was like don't date boys and i was like okay you don't have to worry about that because i was like making out with girls um you know at parties but then in the open i was kind of like dating boys and it was this kind this idea that i was like preparing to be someone's wife and so that part of me was always hidden until i moved to the states and then when i went to hopkins and i saw all of these like out and proud queer people i was like this is a thing you can be out and proud and you can be queer like this and that's amazing and so that i was like really drawn to it and i remember so that at that point i had already started dating my now husband. While I was dating him, I was kind of coming to terms with the fact that I am bisexual. And I think this is something that a lot of people struggle with, right? Because I think women especially are so, like compulsory heterosexuality affects us the most, where it's this idea. If anyone has read like the Lesbian Masterdoc, I really highly encourage, you don't have to be a lesbian or questioning to read it. I think it has such a great breakdown of compulsory like heteronormativity in where it encourages women to exclusively look at men as the only sexual and romantic interest, right? And so it doesn't, you grow up in a lot of societies don't encourage women especially to explore their sexuality. They're kind of like already prepping them to be someone's wife, someone's mother. And this idea of sexuality isn't kind of encouraged for you to think about. And so at that time, when I was with my husband, I was like, damn, okay, so I am bisexual, but I felt so guilty about it. But I was like, I'm kind of like, I'm supposed to be like this straight wife. I'm supposed to be X, Y, and Z. And I'm supposed to get pregnant and be this like really hetero woman. But it wasn't for me. And I was going through a lot of like, I was going through like a really deep depression and a really deep anxiety. And I could see that I was like losing weight. It was really taking a toll on my relationship. And so when I was talking to a lot of my queer friends at that time, I think one thing that I noticed is how much happier they felt just kind of like living their truth and like being open about it. And they said that you're like carrying this grief and this guilt, like almost like you feel guilty about it. Coming also from an academic background, I tend to intellectualize things. And so my coping strategy was to read a lot about bisexuality and be like, okay, I'm gonna like inform myself because I know that this feeling is there, but maybe I need to back it up with some data and I need to read about it. So I kind of did that. And the deep dive that I did had kind of shown me that, you know, 80% of people who are bisexual are in like heterosexual presenting marriages. So there are 50% of the community of the LGBT community, which like we are a large number of, you know, this is talking about people who are out, not people who are closeted.
SPEAKER_04:But
SPEAKER_03:50% of us are bisexual. In fact, more trans people are bisexual. And so I was like, okay, wow. So we're out there. So why aren't we like talking about this? But we're all kind of like ashamed about it. And I was also reading studies that show that bisexual people women are also like less likely to come out and kind of struggle in this like gray area because they also have these higher rates of like domestic violence and violence and so i think that Learning about this interesting space that I'm in where it's like, yes, I have proximity to privilege because I can apply for a house. I can apply for a mortgage. And I was just reading yesterday that Thailand just legalized same sex marriage. I didn't have that problem. I can go to a courthouse tomorrow and celebrate my love openly. I can hold my partner's hand. We live in this heterosexual society. And so I get a lot of those privileges. But it's also like there's a lot of stigma that I still have to face. Like it often feels like if I'm not my biggest advocate, I'm not my biggest ally. And then people are just like, OK, OK, girl, like you don't know what it means to be queer. And I disagree with that because I think that a lot of about being queer isn't who you're having sex with and like who you're like kind of like openly dating. I think it's more like. I think it's like in the life that you live, right? It's about like chosen family. It's about community. It's about giving back. It's about, you know, understanding that sexuality is so much more than it is. Yes, partnership and it is sex, but it's also so much more than that. So I think it's like, yeah, it's just so nuanced. And there's just so many thoughts and feelings about my identity. And I'm constantly talking about it in therapy, but I, I think that the fluidity I think is, has been really incredible for me to embrace because it really does show that sexuality is a spectrum, right?
SPEAKER_05:So would love to kind of double click into the, you know, bisexuality of it all. You know, there are a lot of persistent myths around bisexuality and I'm curious, like, what is your approach to dismantling these biphobic myths? Just because there's a lot of negative connotations associated with the bisexual community. Yeah. Would love to hear your thoughts on that.
SPEAKER_03:A big part of the work that I do on social media is education. And I think like visibility, you know, people are like, why are you like constantly talking about it? It's always attention seeking. But I've had so many, especially, you know, being brown and being from this really conservative culture, there are still so many brown people that are in my DMs that are like, wow, you have actually like just seeing you has helped me kind of like break down some of the internalized myths that I have about being bisexual. Because again, it is one of those things that's mainstream. I think, you know, in Western cultures, it's definitely very mainstream. And there's a lot more acceptance, I think, about like being queer, you know, like Miley Cyrus is a transsexual, you know, Megan Fox is bisexual, Halsey is bisexual. And so we're having a lot more like visibility in that sense and i but i think like for a lot of other countries this idea of of visibility really matters right because that also like helped break down a lot of the myths and i think i'm also in a position where i have a bit of thick skin and so when people are like oh you're having three sons so you're like cheating on your husband and you're just doing this for attention i'm like yes okay and like like i'm gonna this is really my first like that's what social media is for social media is literally like you're doing this for attention yes, so that I can get someone's attention and I can influence their thinking. That is literally what this app is all about. So I don't know what you are telling me that I should be doing differently. And I think I want to challenge notions about bisexuality. I think another big part of of what I try to educate people on through like also breaking myths and saying, no, we are not greedy. No, we are not promiscuous because narratives like that are incredibly harmful and they bleed into society, like with healthcare providers thinking that, you know, having to question or ask invasive questions, like they're not really trained on how to ask questions about the sexual history. And so they end up making people feel worse than they are and triggering parts of their identity and already bisexual people face this. this you know we are less likely to come out and we're kind of like grappling with should i shouldn't i which is a really really if anyone has ever been in the closet you know how horrible that feeling is nobody can relate to that and so then you're like avoiding health care which affects your health and your bisexual women especially are less likely to get tested for less likely to get pap smears, and as a result, are more likely to get cervical cancer. And so, you know, I think it's like part of the education is also saying that this is who we are, like, instead of just breaking down the myths, it's also showing that your myths and the ways in which you all are perpetuating biphobia and bi erasure has a direct effect. on our health, has a direct effect on our mental health, like higher rates of like depression, anxiety, suicidal ideation, substance use. I mean, the data is there. So I think that's what's a part of it is not just saying stop, like don't bully a bisexual person. It's more like your actions actually have direct consequences. on our livelihood it has direct consequences on who we are as people and it's also educating the bisexual community as well i think one thing that i want to make very clear that i also was grappling with in the beginning is this idea of like heterosexual privilege or like passing privilege doesn't exist and i think like also for the bisexual community it's educating them like yes you are bisexual but i also want you to think about like social positioning right um i want you to think about privilege and oppression like we're in this really unique place where especially if you are in a heterosexual marriage like
SPEAKER_01:you
SPEAKER_03:are equal parts privileged and equal parts oppressed and so like how do you navigate that because it's so complex and the myth is i think that there are still a lot of myths around that that you know yes we can take up space but it also means that you know there are other people within the community that need more help, that need more support, especially like trans people. And it's not to say that we don't belong in the community. It just means that within the community itself, we're more in a point of privilege. So I think there's myth busting on both sides because I think that's what they want. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. And I think to your point, I think like the fact that like they make up the largest block of the LGBTQ plus community and yet they're the ones that are getting a lot of erasure, you know, I think like that's really unfortunate. Like a lot of the focus, you know, goes on to lesbian and gay individuals. And I think, you know, I think trans people face, you know, erasure as well. I think those are the two kind of communities within that umbrella that really are facing that. And I think it's, it's harmful for their own existence, but I think it's harmful, like on a wider scale of like not, understanding that our society is made up of all these different individuals and that, you know, impacts different public accommodations, whether it's healthcare or safety or housing or what have you. So there's a lot to that. Yeah. So would love to talk a little bit about actually fluid health, my fluid health. What led you to create this organization and would love to know how does it support individuals experiencing chronic pelvic and sexual pain?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So my goal was always to create better access to care. And that's always what I was interested in, you know, drawing from my health care background and from going to public health school. I think I'm really interested in systems level thinking and changing the system because I think individual action is great, and I think there are a lot of providers that are doing the work. My partner is a doctor, and he does a lot of work in addiction and working one-to-one with patients. And at the same time, a lot of the work that we want to do is systems level thinking, because if you don't change how we access care and how we can improve like the healthcare experience for different populations, then we're never going to get to where we need to get to. And so I think that was kind of the, at the root of the work that I'm doing. And I had, we had strategically chosen chronic pelvic pain because I noticed two things. So a big part of building. So we have an app right now that connects people, women and sexual minorities who have chronic pelvic pain or any type of pelvic pain or sexual pain with sex therapists. So you can book a 15 minute console call, which is free with the therapist. And then we also help you prep for it and we give you the emotional support that you need. And we had built this after I had interviewed over 200 people, like I did put out surveys and I had a lot of conversations with people. And overwhelmingly, when I was talking to women, especially queer women, I found that a lot of them don't feel heard or seen by their providers, which we know is a big issue. A lot of queer people are afraid to access care. But I also think like women, especially, really, there's a lot of stigma in having to like, a talk about not just your sexuality, but talk about the intimate details of your like sex life. I found that when you go to the OBGYN, and you're kind of just like, you know, I just had the surgery or, you XYZ happened and I'm not able to have sex, they're kind of just like, oh yeah, I have a glass of wine before bed. Or, you know, figure it out. And then as a columnist for Allure, I had written this article on like vaginismus, which is this condition where the vagina contracts or spasms every time you try to have penetrative sex. And a lot of people live with vaginismus. And so I was doing this article and I usually put out a call for action, like call for like people to talk to me so I could report their stories. And I had like I think a hundred responses of people being like, yeah, I have it. And I have no one to talk to. Would you tell my story? And I was like, okay, there is something here. Like I'm seeing this like really stigmatized condition that people are experiencing. And I'm also seeing that you know, they're also having a hard time kind of like accessing care about it. And so when I when we had like, we first initially thought, okay, let's do sexual dysfunction, which is, you know, right now, there's a lot of products in the market for penis owners, you know, they have erectile dysfunction pills that you can get from like hims and hers, or you can like go to the doctor, and there's Viagra, there's more studies done in in, you know, men and people who have penises, even though the number, the percentage of women and queer people that have sexual dysfunction are much higher. There are less options in the market right now for them to deal with sexual dysfunction. And then within that, we did more market research and we found that pain, especially like chronic pelvic pain, disproportionately affects lesbian and bisexual women more than it affects heterosexual women. So we were like, okay, so like women are like struggling with pain. They can't really talk about it because as we've seen, pain is an incredibly gendered experience. It's this idea that queer people are used to pain or like women are used to pain. So this is just another thing that they have to deal with. They can go up to seven years without getting a diagnosis. So they're just living seven years without a diagnosis, taking pills, kind of bouncing around doctors, not really knowing what to do. And so then we thought, okay, so if we're connecting them with care, we know that the experience that they have going through like accessing care is hard because no one believes them no one takes their identity into account no one is sort of like giving them the support that they need to figure things out and i think for like people and women like our relationship to health is dependent on our relationship to other people so a lot of the times we avoid care because we're like there's no one to take care of my child or i don't have access to insurance again because you're queer or you're a person of color and that's just how the system is built And so there are all of these like barriers. So that's one of the things that we wanted to do was like also give support for like, so social support, essentially. Like, where are you right now? Are you able to access care right now? How can we make things easier for you? And we chose sex therapy because again, I think the mind body connection is really strong for women and queer people. And it's more a supplement. And that's something that's often overlooked, like the psychological and the emotional support. also you deserve to have great sex like i'm so sorry
SPEAKER_04:that should be yes if
SPEAKER_03:you think that women are not having sex and you're constantly shaming us for having sex no we want to have sex we it's not people think like oh we want to have sex because we're promiscuous no i want to have a relationship i want to have intimacy with my partner Like that's one way that I want to express love, but that's kind of not again, like socially acceptable. Right. So when you're seeking care to have sex or you're seeking care to like, want to be able to enjoy it, you feel bad. You're like, why, why do I feel like such a fiend? Like this shouldn't happen. I think that was a part of what we're trying to normalize is like, no, like, you know, a lot of them come to, the sex therapist, only when their partners start getting, like when there's like a fight between them and their partners where, oh, you're not having sex with me. And I think so much of our body, and I could talk about this for hours, as you can tell, but I think it's like, you know, our bodies, I think so many, so much of like queer people and like women, there's this idea that our body is like utilitarian. that we exist to please someone sexually, or that we exist to just get pregnant, or that we exist to do labor for the system that doesn't give us a lot back in return. And so that when you're seeking help for something that's innate to who you are, like in exploring your sexuality, exploring your sex life, that doesn't feel natural. And I think that's what we're trying to do is we're trying to normalize a big part of that. So we have our pilot right now. We're very excited. I think in a couple of months, we're going to launch it a little bit more wider so we have more people using our app
SPEAKER_05:that's amazing congratulations that's such a huge i think it's it's the work and research you did in order to bring this to life i think is so impressive and like your passion to you know scale this wider i think is so important because i think this is as you you know saw on your dms like this is an issue that is very common and it's stigmatized and it's not talked about enough and so it's like to have you be such a trailblazer in that space, I think is so important for so many people. So I think that's fantastic. I would love to, yeah. And I would love to hear kind of like, has there been kind of a moment in the process that you've been, you know, working within fluid health that has really reaffirmed like a specific moment that's really reaffirmed the importance of your mission and how you're carrying it out and what you're trying to accomplish?
SPEAKER_03:I will say that right now, this is something I always think about actually. So all of the people working with me right now are black and brown queer women. Like, you know, we are queer and trans people, like, like all of us. And I think that to me is like, cause I would always think, I think I had this, like someone tell me, they were like, oh yeah, if you ever want to raise money for your startup, you need to have a man or you need to have like a white man with you because that's just who they give money to and it's right i think that that's right because like flow which is like a period app which is like just raised i think cdsb or cdc hundreds of millions of dollars is run by two white guys two white guys are running a period app and then if you also look at most of the sex toy brands or you look at most of the like women's health like apps they are run by men straight men so that to me is just like it pisses me off when people say that and i'm just sometimes i'm just i feel that pressure sometimes i'll be honest
SPEAKER_04:and
SPEAKER_03:you know there are a lot of solutions out there but i can tell that the people who are working with me You know, right now we are in a phase where, again, I think, you know, early startup life, there's, you're sort of like, you're just trying to like show proof of concept and you're trying to show that your product works. So you're not really like bringing money. And in fact, it'll take like maybe a year or two before you like break even. And then you start, that's just how business works. And sometimes I wonder, I'm like, oh, why are they like doing a lot of this? Like pro bono? Like, why are they like here week after week? engineers helping me, my advisors meeting with me and connecting me with so many people. It's because they want to see that because they know. And I was like, okay, it's making sense now. It's because queer, black and brown queer women struggle to access care and they see a need for this. And so they are obviously the people that are here willing to do the labor and give their time and their effort towards building this. And I think that's what it is, right? I think that that's affirming for me is like, you know, we're building it for ourselves. And right now, like we get the feedback, we're getting feedback. I mean, the road hasn't always been easy. You know, there've been, we're still learning a lot. And I think a big part of learning is failing and like making mistakes. And, but I think like on the bright side, we can see the promise and like a lot of people are like, oh my God, I'm really excited. Like, it feels like I'm talking to a friend and I, you know, women and queer people really want care to be informal. And so that's what we're trying to do is really trying to bring this like, this intimacy to healthcare. I think, you know, this communalism to healthcare. And so when we're seeing positive feedback about that, I feel, I feel affirmed. So yeah, I feel it's like, I think that part has been really affirming for us.
SPEAKER_05:That's fantastic. Yeah. Cause I think like a lot of, and I'll speak to my experience of healthcare, but like it's clinical and there's like that lack of connection, I think in the human side of it, because I think like a lot of people, and maybe in the medical professional, like they do a lot of work with different people. And I think over time it maybe desensitizes them so that it's, you know, they lose, I think, sometimes that human element that I think is so important for people who experience a lot of just different things outside of the general population that they serve. I think it's an important part. I love that that's something that Fluid Health is doing to connect people with Compassionate care. I think that's essential, truly. So, you know, as someone who is, you know, starting an organization, a startup of this sort, you know, I think imposter syndrome naturally becomes a part of the equation. You know, there's a lot of things that you're learning in the process of building this that kind of can pervade the, you know, overall like experience of starting something up that's brand new that you have taken from paper to reality. Can you kind of unpack a little bit like what your experience has been around that?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I'm not going to lie. It has been incredibly stressful. And I think that's, again, because I was looking, again, because I love Deva and I love numbers. Me too. Good. I'm glad because I feel like that's what I went to school for. Like, I, you know, I love, I think that Again, I think data can be flawed sometimes, but I use it to inform a lot of my work and my understanding of the world. And I'm a scientist. I feel like I went to med school, I went to public health school, and I feel like a lot of it, I want it to be science-based. But 1% of the funding, less than 1% went to queer founders as a whole. And even within that, even less goes to know black and brown folks less goes towards trans folks so it's a lot of like again like you know cis gay men um like white gay men you know and i think that that's also like that's one of the things that i find really stressful is again this idea of like who i should be to get to where i need to go when who i'm building for like you know this work is still important and also i think you know from what we've also seen in this election like there's so much of like identity politics in the sense of like, I think that there's this idea that, you know, women again aren't like leaders or we aren't meant to do business or like this is something that doesn't come naturally to us. And also the idea that they're like, it's not even the idea. I think I face so much of pressure to do things right all the time. Every time I mess up or I fuck up, I actually feel so nervous because I think the general public, as we've seen, is just so much harsher on women than they are on men. We can very evidently tell by our president and the idea that even though he had so many court cases, he's a convicted felon, rapist, that's fine, he can still be president. That will not, we don't exist in a world where that reality is possible for like a woman, let alone someone who is queer or someone who is like a person of color. You know what I mean? So I think I feel a lot of that pressure to like do things right. Cause I often feel like I'm subject to a lot more scrutiny and there's again, like just an overall pressure. So I think that that's definitely, I think the other side of the entrepreneurship struggle that, you know it's just something that i'm learning to deal with but i think this is the thing i was talking to one of my my engineers yesterday and she was just like you know you if you have a secret sauce and you're building it for the people and they want to exist it will exist regardless of how things go and we're also in the age of aquarius you know what i mean like we just have to do things differently now it's just not going to work like the cis white way anymore. It's just not. I think that we're starting to realize that. And I think we're like, there's an impending revolution happening. So that's giving me, spiritually, in an astrological sense, it's giving me a lot of courage. But the stress and the imposter syndrome. And for a long time, I just didn't feel like I belonged in certain rooms. J.B. Morgan invited me for dinner the other day, took us to a Broadway show. And I was like, what am I doing here? Everyone is so much more accomplished and is so much further in their business than I am. And I think a big part of that is, no, you deserve to be here. They wouldn't have invited you if you didn't deserve to be here. And you absolutely deserve to be here. But I think so much of it is also, I'm changing so much as I build this business. And I think building that, yes, you belong. Yes, you're doing it. Yes, it matters. I think that that's also been incredibly healing.
SPEAKER_05:A hundred percent. And I also think that a lot of the criticism of just female leaders, female business owners steeped in misogyny. That is what it is. And it's like, it's, they've built this system in a way that discourages women from being able to do that. And that's the problem is that the fact that you've internalized this messaging that, you know, even maybe even minor mistakes are bigger things than they actually are. It's really, I think how the system is meant to work, unfortunately. And it's like, you know, you are, you, doing amazing, impactful work that is changing people's lives. And the fact that you are not a cisgender male doesn't preclude you from the fact that you are just as driven, just as passionate, are doing things that are just as big of a scale. And I think that that shouldn't stop you because it's like, the impact of what you're doing is so wide reaching. And I think, you know, help more people that need to be helped.
SPEAKER_03:Thank you. Oh my God. Yes. And again, like one of my friends was like, she's like, you just need to think like a, like a finance bro. And I was like, if the finance broke into it, I can
SPEAKER_05:do it. That's the whole thing at the end of the day. It's like, you are fully capable of doing anything that anybody
SPEAKER_04:else can.
SPEAKER_05:Anybody that tells you otherwise is trying to prevent you from doing it. That's just plain and simple. You know what I
SPEAKER_04:mean?
SPEAKER_05:So I want to talk about your TED Talk because I watched it and it is so good. First of all, like obsessed. I want to talk about like you emphasize like unlearning societal norms around sexuality and health. Yeah. I want to know like how can people begin in this process in their own lives of like unlearning a lot of like misinformation or untruths or half truths around sexuality and health.
SPEAKER_03:It's so interesting because I think that again, it's like multi, it's so, it works at different layers and you know, it's your personal conversation and it's like your community, it happens at a personal level, community level and interpersonal level. And then it also happens at like a systemic or a societal level. And you know, so much of it kind of depends and so in your conversations i think it's we also like grow up in this like binary like you know where we're like male female like this is what it is and i i think that one thing i encourage people to do is kind of like push themselves to think outside of that because we are so uncomfortable thinking about that because we have to know we don't we have we're struggling to find to feel comfortable in this like area where we don't really know what the answer is. And I think that's where a lot of the intolerance comes from. I think it comes from fear. The hatred comes from fear. A lot of the violence comes from fear. you know, we're not comfortable as a society kind of like embracing that. But again, I think, you know, that's one of the reasons why so many people are like pushing for sex education or like inclusive sex education in schools. It's not that we're trying to teach your kid how to have sex, like we're teaching, it's harm reduction. And we're not teaching that to like fourth graders, we're obviously teaching that to like high schoolers so that they can feel prepared and be more like, again, it's harm reduction, right? We're trying to prepare them in the eventuality that they decide to have sex, to have safer sex. But for like younger kids, I think it's so much about sex education is teaching them that what is a good touch, what's a bad touch. People are different, and sometimes they look different, and that's OK. It doesn't mean anything. And I think so much of intolerance and homophobia and transphobia is learned. We are teaching it in the house. are teaching that to our kids. We are perpetuating that. It's this idea that if they exist, I can't exist. But that's because you were never given that space growing up. And so much of it is when I was young, I reflect on this so much where my dad would not let me wear pants. He only wanted me to wear dresses. And he never had that space to kind of unlearn what it meant know like is it that you know she's allowed to express herself the way that she wants to and that's okay and that's safe and there are just like so many unfortunately again we're like moving into this in this direction i guess even in america you know we like to think about this like liberal democracy but so much of it is like parents telling their kids that I'm going to kick you out if you're queer or like, I only want a boy, I don't want a girl. And we have still not in a place where we're like comfortable unlearning about like unlearning some of the harmful gender norms, right? And so that's what I talk about in my TED talk as well is like, If we as a society are not willing to have those uncomfortable conversations and to accept that there are things that exist outside of what we know right now, then we're never going to advance. And I think that's the fundamental issue.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. And for those who have not seen the TED Talk, make sure you watch it. It's fantastic. Highly recommend it. No, I loved it. It was fantastic. I want to talk now a little bit about combating gender-based violence because I think this is a really important issue. And you've highlighted it, you know, in the role of sex education and reducing harm. What changes would you like to see in kind of global sex education practices that you think would help address the issues around gender-based violence?
SPEAKER_03:First off, having sex education at every single level will reduce violence. gender-based violence because studies have actually shown, again, that it improves tolerance and that understanding of other genders, right? And so at baseline, if you just have inclusive sex education in all schools, that's great. I think the second thing is also, unfortunately, I think so much of the reading I do is around, again, the gender binary and internalized sexism and even thinking about various cultures. we have all of these practices that come as a result of the patriarchy, as a result of this idea that men are superior to women. Again, because we view women's bodies as utilitarian. I think one way that we are perpetuating gender-based violence is because of that. It's because we think that men are superior to women and that Even when you think about, especially I'll use sexuality as an example. I was watching a show yesterday. And I don't know if you've ever seen The Morning Show, but this is just an example.
SPEAKER_04:Yes,
SPEAKER_03:you have. And I think in one episode, for one of the male co-anchors' birthdays, they brought out a cake. And they brought out all of these women to dance. And they're dancing. They're wearing wigs. And they're wearing these. Like this basically like this onesie kind of like a sexy onesie.
SPEAKER_05:And
SPEAKER_03:I was just thinking, I was like, damn, okay. Like when men want sex, it's something that's so accessible, right? It's this idea that their sexuality and their like need to have sex is there.
SPEAKER_04:And
SPEAKER_03:so like, that's their right. Like you can't, like, even when you think about sentences, like you can't wear that, you can't like, you know, you're like teasing me or you're not, you're like instigating me or like, I can't control my urges, but the same doesn't apply for like women, right? Like we don't have brothels for women to go to, or we don't have like shows that we can go to, you know, we can't really like use our body in that way. And so like, fundamentally, I think that gender-based violence also exists as this idea that sexuality is inherent or sex is inherent to who men are and that's who they are. But when it comes to women, it's this idea that sexuality and sex, when it comes to them, is evil and it's bad. And if you look at a lot of religion, Even like with Eve eating the apple, like she ate the apple because she was lustful. Like she ate an apple. Okay. It's an apple. It's not a dildo. It's an apple. Like, you know, like, but they were like, oh my God, she's responsible for the downfall of society and women must be controlled. And it's like, you know, I also think there's so much in Hinduism, like, and even in Buddhism as well, where this idea that like, Men should know better than to hang around women. We have demons and angels, and that women who are inherently lustful are responsible for the downfall of humanity. And so their sexuality must be controlled. And so I think a lot of gender-based violence is in this idea that women are inherently evil if they're exercising their sexuality. And so a lot of the gender-based violence is rooted in controlling that sexuality, in controlling who they are. And even when it comes to sex workers, I don't understand, to me, it doesn't make sense how when men have an expectation that women should be sex workers or that they have the right to sex or use their bodies for sex, that they get angry when they are sex workers or that women, when like people are on OnlyFans, it just doesn't make sense to me. Because I'm like, more than 90% of men watch porn. Like the industry exists because of you. then you're vilifying and you're angry with the women who are participating in the system it just is it's like not making sense so i think a lot of it yeah is i think a lot of it is again tied to this notion that like women's sexuality has to be controlled or it's deviant and then men inherently have access or that they're the only people that can have access to sex and sexuality and their right to exercise that
SPEAKER_05:yeah 100 and i think like it's that kind of the trope around like either they're the virgin or the deviant. And it's like, it's at the end of the day, it really centers around like control and maintaining this like patriarchal society that benefits them while ensuring that women continue to come in second to whatever the pursuit and goals of the male are, which I think is really, I mean, we've seen what, what, what that's done over the past hundreds of years, whatever, it's not, not a great thing. You know what I mean? And it's like, that has to be dismantled over time so that, Women and other minorities are able to exist in a way that they're celebrated. They're not objectified. They're not put in unsafe situations. They're not vilified. All of those things that are done because it's a matter of power, structure, and control. You know what I mean? Really unfortunate because it hurts and harms a lot of people globally and men are the ones that get to benefit the most from it. So we'd love to talk a little bit about intersectionality in healthcare. Given your medical background, how does that inform your approach to address unique health challenges faced by LGBTQ plus individuals, especially those that are at multiple intersections of marginalization?
SPEAKER_03:My belief is that at baseline, healthcare should be built for them. they should expand out to everybody else because if you are able to serve the person who is already living at multiple marginalized identities then you can serve anybody like you know it's kind of when it comes to feminism as well like you know when i worked at planned parenthood like that's one of the things that they said is like if you are able to build a world where that centers black women then everybody benefits and i think that's so true right like if you are able to build health care benefits again like black women like queer black women or people who are disabled um who are already living at like multiple marginalized identities then like everybody benefits right but the problem is that healthcare starts with the white able-bodied person and it's again very prescriptive and it's meant for only one type of person And then from there, they try to like open it up to different populations. And I just don't, I personally don't think that works. I think it's an afterthought. I think it's something that's kind of like, oh yeah, we're also, I guess, thinking about you, but it's like, well, no, you're not because like the ways in which we access healthcare are extremely different and highly politicized and so much to do with like who we are as people. And most of healthcare doesn't exist that way currently. the system that we're in right now only seeks to traumatize people over and over again. I remember working at the Yale ED, and I was working with someone who had substance use issues, and they were enrolled in part of a study. And so I was going to give them a gift card for just filling out a survey. And one of the doctors came to me and was like, oh, yeah, how do you know that it's not going to use it on drugs again? And I was like, know at baseline if we're already like existing from a place where like there is a norm and there is an abnormal and you're like already looking at this person who's like not being the norm you're further stigmatizing him and you're not actually helping him because okay so what if he uses drugs like do you and and that to me is just like blows my mind again is that so much of healthcare is like just is literally that. That if you are not, like, why would they come back again and ask you for help if that's the kind of attitude that you have? But unfortunately, like even in big institutions like that, it still happens, right? And I think that's where from the get-go, we need, to me, like, again, I think the other thing that I also feel like often at odds with is I think queer calling it queer health is important. Women's health is important so that the right people know where to go. But I like to envision a world where, again, from the get-go, the health care that we build is queer-affirmative. And so right now, even with Fluid, our target population are queer people. And we want them to come first. And we want to serve them first. And then we open it up to everybody else. But that's our goal, is to build this foundation that is already serving people who are brown and queer people of color. Black or queer people of color, and then also spreading out to everybody else. Because I think that's what health care should be. But I think sometimes we have so many silos of like, this is only for women. But queer people do need their own health care. But I think so much, I hope that we can live in a world where everything at baseline is already queer-affirmative, is already culturally competent.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, absolutely. So I would love to talk a little bit about body positivity and empowerment. And I think that's been central to the work that you've done. And I would love to know how can queer communities foster healthier body image standards? Because I think there's a lot of types of bodies that are considered higher value than other bodies. Yeah. I think that's really harmful for a lot of people in general because there's people who are trying to attain certain body types that may be doing unhealthy behaviors, but would love to hear how you would foster healthier body image standards in general for the wider community.
SPEAKER_03:You know, I probably can't give that good of an answer here because again, I live my life from someone who does have like a thin body. And so like, I don't face a lot of the stigma that different bodies face. I think that, you know, people who are intersex, you know, people who are plus size can probably answer that question much better. But I think again, from, from a healthcare point of view, I think so much again is stigmatizing because again bodies are politicized and like so many of the people that i talk to even from my work column are constantly like oh yeah the doctor just tells me that if i lose weight everything will be okay i think that's why olympic is so like crazy like so crazy popular is because people think that getting thin is the answer and i'm sure if that's your goal is that you want to lose weight and like yes i think like having a higher body mass or a body fat is you know can lead to a lot of like health issues like heart disease but again like i think being thin doesn't necessarily mean you're healthy i think that's one of the things that i've seen is like from the get-go people look at me and they're like oh my god you're so healthy and it's like i live with two autoimmune diseases and i'm like struggling to put on weight because of all the inflammation in my body but like I'm allowed to exist in society and not deal with that kind of stigma, but I'm kind of like dying on the inside. And I feel like even when I talk to my providers, I'm just like, they're like, you look healthy and you look fine. And I'm like, well, I'm not. And I'm really skinny and I'm losing weight. And I don't know where I come from in India. People are curvy. I want to be curvy. I want to put on more weight, but that doesn't, I think that it's so interesting because again, so much of it is like based on like, the ideal body or like the ideal body is healthy. And I think from a healthcare point of view, that's what I often see. And like dismissing women and telling them that they need to lose weight in order to be healthier or only treating conditions from a weight a based point of view. Many doctors don't understand trans bodies. They don't understand intersex bodies. Another thing that I was actually thinking about the other day was when I was thinking about even lupus and the idea that I might have lupus, all of the pictures that I was seeing were rashes on white people. And I kept thinking, what does a rash actually look like, like the butterfly rash look like on brown skin? And I couldn't really find it on an Indian person. And so I was like, damn. How will they know then? Like have they been misdiagnosing me this entire time? And so even when I think about like body positivity, I think like the diversity of the human experience is really remarkable, right? And so I don't think medicine and healthcare has done enough to take that into consideration. So a lot of people are not getting the right healthcare that they need because they don't have the right bodies or that doctors haven't seen those conditions on their bodies. They've only seen it on one type of body. So I think that that's again, like one of the conversations that I'm continuing to have is like also encouraging a lot of like healthcare to think about that. There's actually one page by this doctor. He started when he was a med student and he actually started posting pictures of like what conditions look like on black skin or like how they show up, like how melanoma shows up on black skin. And I think that kind of education is really powerful, right? Or like sometimes, you know, when trans people like show their like top surgery I think that's great because we need to see and we need to learn that. We need to accept. And that's why I think visibility, again, is just so important. I think there are individuals doing this incredible advocacy. And I can find some of their pages and send it to you as well. And I think they do so much of incredible work. And I think following their profile, I've read so much about intersex bodies now and their developmentally diverse bodies as well. developmental sexual it's dsd i don't know what the full form is i have to look at it again but i think that that's another thing right like so much of there used to be so much of surgeries happening against their consent to again put fit them in the binary because health care is violent and we don't serve different bodies in that sense i think now there's been a growing pressure on doctors to stop they still aren't able to see their unethical ways but i think like individuals are really pushing for change as well
SPEAKER_05:Awesome. Okay. So would love to talk about advocacy and the work you do around being a sex columnist for Allure, which is so cool, by the way. And obviously running for other major platforms too. I'm curious, like, how do you balance like relatable content with advancing sexual health advocacy?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Well, I have a great editor. Shout out to my editor, Kara. And she really, when I pitched the column to her, she was really excited and has always gone with my formats and my vision, which whenever I write an article, I want it to be as, I want it to involve like a level of advocacy and activism as well. So we're not just teaching you to have sex, but I think a big part of it is also like examining What are the cultural biases? What kind of biases exist within the system? Who is marginalized? And I love, love, love, love that most of the voices that I include in my column are brown women. A lot of Indian women reach out to me, and they're like, I want to talk about sex. And we come from such a sex-negative culture. It's crazy that all of them, when I read the stories, I'm like, yes, oh my god. Yes, we are having threesomes. Yes, we are going to sex parties. Yes, we love BDSM. And I think that is so powerful, again, because going back to my earlier point, this idea that sex and exercising sexuality only belongs to one group of the population, when in fact, sex is so liberatory to so many other people, this understanding of our bodies. And it isn't just like, oh, I'm having sex. It's so much about who am I? What does it say about me? I think a lot of what I include in the articles as well as like, what is the self, you know, BDSM again is, you know, we talk about like consent culture in BDSM, but also the fact that like BDSM can be an incredibly like spiritual experience for a lot of people, because it kind of challenges you to think about power and control in a really, really nuanced way, which, so that was one of the things I wrote about when I wrote about the sex worker article and, wasn't just interviewing sex workers about the types of lipsticks and makeup that they use when they're having sex um so it doesn't doesn't melt but it was also like talking about erotic labor and again how we like as a society benefit off of these people but then they have the least amount of access to basic human rights so there are a lot of these agencies now that are giving legal support and housing support. And sex workers are considered a small business, but they don't have a lot of the access to the small business privileges that I would have access to or anyone else would have access to. But part of that article was also writing about how sex work actually boosts the economy. We don't want to talk about that. So I think a big part of all of the articles I write about, again, is including that layer of privilege this view on like society and culture as well, because I think so much of sex is tied to that. You can't write about sex without writing about society and culture and control.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, absolutely. And I think like in general, like to be able to have sex, to be able to enjoy sex is liberation in some ways. Now being able to, you know, control your own self and, you know, in consenting relationships, obviously that's a dynamic kind of nuance there, but
SPEAKER_04:like,
SPEAKER_05:about really owning your identity and being able to be liberated to do as you want with full autonomy. And I think that's super powerful and empowering in general. And I love all the articles that you've written for it. It's been really fun reading.
SPEAKER_04:Thank you. I
SPEAKER_05:know, I think it's so great. I think it's like very... essential learning because it's like we don't get that type of sexual health education in schools or in colleges or even media. Like media, oftentimes they perpetuate a lot of harmful stereotypes around sexuality, minimize things and do it a lot of times from the male gaze or from a cis white hat, you know. Yeah. you right and then the experiences of queer communities and you know different diverse minorities
SPEAKER_03:yeah you know i i was watching sex in the city and like so much of her column as well i think when we think about a traditional sex column it's about like your sex experiences and the kind of sex that you're having but let's just be really really blunt and honest and say that yeah sex like certain groups of people are allowed to have sex more than others and allowed to talk about it but also sex is an incredibly shameful experience for a lot of people like a lot of people come from different cultural and religious backgrounds where sex is a sin some so many people haven't masturbated there are still people who haven't had an orgasm who feel really uncomfortable being you know open with their sexuality about you know so many people are still in lavender marriages or in the closet how are they having sex so i think like it's also part part of it of the column is that, is like, I do want to center that. And I think my editor and what Allure is also doing is like trying to break through that, you know, and not make it like, just like, I'm not just talking about my own experiences. Like that's not what the sex column is about. It's about like, how are we as a society having sex? And like, let's talk about that.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. And I think by, by being able to talk about these topics that are like, taboo when they really shouldn't be. I think it puts, like you said, it's a lot about putting shame on sexuality and the whole, again, kind of laddering into like the control part of it, the, you know, self-esteem issues around it. But it's like, the more we talk about it, the more we normalize this conversation around sexual health and the diversity that can make up that, the better off our wider society and culture is because then that our considered taboo are actually not considered taboo and they're able to be educated on all the different aspects around it. More research can be done and more information because at the end of the day, information is power. And to be able to have more information allows people at the wider society to do more and be more safe and more secure in whatever they're doing.
SPEAKER_03:Exactly. You know, it's so funny because when I just wrote this recent article on the orgasm, I just realized that i've been having vaginal orgasms for so long but i didn't know that because i went into a deep dive and i was like damn okay that's a thing i had no idea like and that i i myself who's writing about this it was i was telling my husband yesterday i was like damn oh my god like this is life-changing like i'm getting educated by my own column so i think that that's also a big part of it right it's like pulling up this research talking to different people but we're like headed in a good direction so that's good
SPEAKER_05:yeah Agree, agree. Awesome. And so the last question I think is really around advice for advocates out there that are seeing your work, appreciating your work, and wanting to understand how they can impact sexual health and LGBTQ advocacy widely. What steps would you recommend to those people who are trying to advocate for more inclusive sexual health, queer affirming care, that type of thing?
SPEAKER_03:walk the walk and talk the talk like it's not just enough if you're just like i'm an advocate like you have to also like you have to have uncomfortable conversations with the people around you and you know so much of it is like in my own marriage, like talking to my husband and like also reckoning with the fact that like, I'm in this position of like privilege in like this passing relationship and I'm, you know, this talking about bisexuality. And I think so much of it is doing that own personal work and thinking about that. And like, when is it my time to speak up versus when is it my time to just, you know, stand back and let others, you know, take up more space. So I think it's so much of it is that, right? Like, I think so much of like activism is about like social media and showing up and like you know it's really like curated experience and it's also like so much of it is sitting in that discomfort and having those conversations with yourself and so i talk about that in therapy so much i talk about like and my are the actions in my life mirroring the things that i talk about openly and that i write about and so i think that's one one a piece of advice i have the second is choose your medium people yeah some people have social media i'm a writer I use a lot of my writing to do my advocacy. Like that's what I do. As I write, I want to make sure that my words reach the right people. And that has been really cathartic for me. I think writing is an incredibly cathartic experience. If you are a public speaker, do that. I don't really like posting a lot on social media. I feel like I used to do that a lot. And I have since kind of like moved on because for me, social media didn't feel nourishing. It felt more like an echo chamber versus I felt like, writing has been some and reading has been so like incredible. So I read a lot of books. I'm reading all about love by bell hooks right now. And you know, it's it's just so life changing. And I think that was one of my goals for 2025 is to like educate myself more and read more. And then also like right through my lower column and whatever I'm writing is like meaningful. And I don't take on projects where I'm not able to do that. So I would say like choose your medium. And I think the third piece of advice I have is activism can be really draining. And you can't, you know, if you're like being inflammatory, like consistently, and you're like always looking for conflict and you think, I think it's choose your battles, win the war. You know, I think that that's what it is. If there are some moments where you're like, my energy is not best spent here, and this is futile, it's not worth it. Versus like, what could you be doing that's more meaningful? Could you be, you know, participating in mutual aid? Could you be redistributing your wealth? Can you volunteer more? You know, is there like something else that you can do? Can you just by being a good community member itself, I think is still powerful enough. So instead of sitting on social media and fighting in the comments, or like, you know, I think that there you if you want to do that, you can, but I found that for me, it was really draining, like trying to get someone from don't know ohio or oklahoma like that's not where my energy is best spent i think my energy was best spent like redistributing my wealth or like thinking about like which groups i could participate in um yeah you know healthcare is kind of like where i can do the most impact because that's my background. So that's where I'm going to focus. And yes, I support all the other causes, but this is the one that I feel that I can do the most of like my, this is where my energy is best spent. So I think that's something that I've learned across my journey because I used to feel like having, like picking up fights with my dad or my mom would be like where I thought my activism was best served. I've just remarked that I can't change them. I can probably limit my interactions on some of the things that they say, and I can send them resources. But also, I think I can make more of an impact in other areas as well.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, no, that's great. And just because I want to make sure we address this before we go into our compulsory questions. what does the future look like for Fluid Health and your broader mission to create the future of queer affirming care, which is like a big question, obviously, but I think would love to hear like where you would like to envision this.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. You know, now, especially with the legislative changes, we've been thinking a lot about like access to care because access to care is and is obviously going to be highly stigmatized and difficult. And so we are going to launch in a couple of weeks the app to a wider audience because right now we're in the pilot we're testing with a very small group of beta testers and then once we release it we kind of want to see what people are looking for and then maybe grow into a bigger care coordinator platform where we can bring on more providers like diverse providers so like physical therapists and doulas and nurses so that people can find the right providers that they need And I think that a lot of it will involve a lot of work in like vetting them. But also I think that taking that emotional, keeping emotional support at the center of it. So growing it into this bigger, like care navigation platform, it's possible. I think that we're also thinking about potentially turning it into a clinic. So I think that again, I go, I want to build something that people need. And I think that that's where we're at right now. We're in that phase where we're trying to also learn what people need because the systems don't exist. right now we're actually building it so i think for the next couple of months as a true scientist we will be in testing phase um and we'll be asking people like what they need and what they want healthcare to look like and so based on that we'll build it but i think right now it's it's between a care navigation platform or a clinic
SPEAKER_05:very cool awesome so now i would like to ask you a few compulsory questions that i asked each of the guests that come on the queers podcast yeah um first one i have for you is is your go-to queer anthem that never fails to get you pumped
SPEAKER_03:this is i know basic b but i love born this way by lady gaga it really every time like i'm obsessed with it but also is it pink pony Club by Chaperone. I'm such a millennial. Oh my God. I love that song. I think it's
SPEAKER_04:so
SPEAKER_03:good. Oh my God. So that would be like a close contender. I think it's between those two.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. I love, I love both those songs. Like with Pink Pony Club specifically though, like I feel like it encapsulates like the queer experience and going to like a gay bar so well of like you're You know, being yourself, you're stepping into your identity. Your parents are kind of like, you know, kind of wanting to stop you from doing that to really embrace your full self. And you're like, no, this is who I am. Like, mama, I'm at Pink Pony Club and I'm going to do what I'm going to do. You know
SPEAKER_03:what I mean? It's the lyrics are so good. Yes. I think it's like not in your face. And those who are queer will probably understand it more, but it's amazing.
SPEAKER_05:Absolutely. Absolutely. Next question is if your identity came with a warning label, what would it say? You
SPEAKER_03:know, I thought about this a lot and I, it's funny because everybody around me is like, oh my God, you are so temperamental. And I'm like warning. I am brutally honest, but it's coming from a place of love. I love that. No nonsense. Like you're not going to come to me and I'm not going to stay silent when you say some shit to my face. I'm just going to be like, I'm going to snap and I'm going to bite, but it's coming from a place of love. Nothing comes from a place of love. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:I love that. That's fantastic. A bite with love. We love that. If you had a queer superpower, what would it be?
SPEAKER_03:Okay, this is my queer superpower. Actually, this is more like if I were like the president, this is what I would do. I think I would like, I think at baseline, everybody should not be like straight. I think the default should be like pansexuality or bisexuality. And then you kind of evolve from there. And then you decide if you want to be straight or you want to be gay or whether you want to remain bisexual or pansexual. But I think my queer superpower would literally give everybody this like space where they feel like they can express their sexuality and have that curiosity. And I think like, that's, that's what I hope for everyone. And sometimes I wish that I talk about this a lot, but I'm like, I just wish everybody were pansexual from the get go. And then you get to decide what it looks like instead of like straight being the default, because I don't think that's working for a lot of us.
SPEAKER_05:I think you're right. I think it's like default heterosexuality, I think is so limiting and it's like, with that superpower, it would absolutely allow people to be able to explore like the spectrum of sexuality and- Exactly.
SPEAKER_03:I
SPEAKER_05:could like a little bit of this, I could like a little bit of that. And it's like, it's all good. You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_03:Exactly. And then I'm now straight from there or like I'm bisexual or like
SPEAKER_05:whatever. Exactly. Like if you want to choose your own event, you want to be straight at the end of the day after being pansexual, like by all means. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I love that. That's a great one. That's a really good one. What is your favorite piece of queer content? And that could be, you know, film, show, book, music, whatever you feel like is something that you really are loving right now. I
SPEAKER_03:love when... you know again we like to like say oh this book is like straight or it's not queer or it's queer but like i love books that kind of explored that as part of the general human experience because i think that's what it is is that we need to normalize sexuality as part of the human experience and not make it a binary again and so i don't know if you've read breast and eggs by me huh
SPEAKER_05:i've i've heard of it i haven't read it yet though
SPEAKER_03:So the main character, Natsuko, is like trying to have a baby. Like she wants to like have a baby, but she's asexual. But she doesn't come out and say like, I'm asexual. She has these really deep, like the way the author has written the character is that she's reflecting on like not having this relationship with sex, but like wanting to be a mother. But then like so much of the society, again, is so like rooted in sex. And so I think that that is my favorite part. piece of queer content is how she explores sex and sexuality and the fact that this person is asexual. And I think such a wonderful representation of ace of people, the ace experience, and also exploring real things like motherhood and relationships, which I don't think we talk about so much. We're often just reducing ace people to like, you don't have sex. What is that like? But it's like, no, she's this really diverse individual And I think that's my favorite book.
SPEAKER_05:That's fantastic. I didn't know. I think the fact that asexual individuals are not widely represented, I think it's such a problem because yes, they may make up a small percentage of the out population of asexuals, but that experience is still an experience that needs to be understood and-
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:you know i think that helps with better understanding our wider society is that when we understand these you know sexual minorities we're able to better support everybody at the end of the day so i think that's that's
SPEAKER_03:so she's yeah she like leads with her experience and like what she's going through in life and then it also brings up that she is ace instead of like going from the fact that she is ace which i which i also think is really powerful like even like breasts and x is is It's about reproduction, motherhood, and so many other things. And so I like that she has brought on. And this is a Japanese woman in Japan. And then it's so nuanced. And it's like, oh, this other part of her that she's also discovering, like her sexuality, versus reducing everything just down to her sexuality, which is something that I feel with myself as well. oh, I am this person and I'm also bisexual. And I often feel like people come to me through the lens of my bisexuality. And I'm like, I'm also this other person who also happens to be bisexual. So.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah. That's, that's very common. I noticed like in just in general media, it's like they limit us to like our sexuality or gender identity. And it's like, we are full-fledged individuals have likes, desires, passions that we want to do stuff that are not necessarily tied to our identity in that
SPEAKER_03:capacity. Exactly. Yeah. I mean, it's also like, you know, with the, I forget the Algerian boxer's name, but like even with them, but there was so much of like how they look, no one focused on the fact that she won and she's an Olympic boxer. It was so much on the fact of like, Oh, she looks like a man and she could be trans. And I think this is, this is a reality for so much, so many queer people. It's like, we are just reduced to our identities and it's like, yes, that is who I am, but I'm also all of these things. So yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, absolutely. And then the last question I have for you is, if you could give your younger self a piece of advice, what would it be?
SPEAKER_03:Your complexity is your strength. Every part of your identity, being queer, Indian, and an activist, I think makes you uniquely qualified to create the change that you want to see. And keep at it. There are a lot of times in your life where you're grappling for labels, because it gives you a sense of security. But I think that sitting with that discomfort and sitting in that fluidity is your superpower, because it doesn't mean that you're confused. It just means that you're creating space that didn't exist before.
SPEAKER_05:Ooh, I love that. That was great. Love that. Thank you, Dr. Srinivasan, for this conversation. It was fantastic. You're brilliant. I'm so excited for Fluid Health and the future. of that organization. Thank you so much for your insights and sharing your journey and your incredible work today. Your dedication to unlearning societal norms, advocating for visibility, and embracing intersectionality is not just inspiring, it's transformative. And for the wider audience that's listening, advocacy, visibility, and inclusivity are revolutionary tools for building a future where queer communities thrive. Dr. Sweeney-Vaasen's story reminds us that self-discovery and authenticity are acts of resilience that can inspire change both the personal and systemic levels. For listeners, please be sure to follow at MyFluidHealth on social media. Dr. Srinivasan, are there any other places that they can find you or anything that they should know about any upcoming projects you have?
SPEAKER_03:Well, just follow me on Instagram at D-R-V-A-R-U-N-A-S-R-I-N-I-V-A-S-A-N or at Dr. Verna Sunevasan. And yeah, keep a lookout for Fluid. If you know someone in your life that has pelvic pain or wants to see a sex therapist, please then send them to us. We'd love to have them use our app and give feedback and build with us. I think that's what we want to build with the community. So if that's you, reach out to us. And yes, thank you so much, Andre, for having me on your podcast. so thoughtful, so insightful, and you've done such amazing research into my background, which is very, very kind. So thank you. I had such a great time chatting with you.
SPEAKER_05:Absolutely. Thank you so much. And for the listeners out there, until next time, please stay curious, stay compassionate, and keep expanding your horizons. Thank you.
SPEAKER_01:And that's a wrap for this episode of The Queerest Podcast. Thank you for joining us on this cosmic journey through the queer universe. If today's conversation resonated with you, be sure to like subscribe and share it with your chosen family your voice helps grow the queerest community until next time stay curious